Grandpa comforts her: 'The skin will peel off — you’ll be pretty again'

КА: Katya Alexander

АП: Aleksandr Pedchenko

АП: Yes, I can hear you perfectly.

КА: Yes-yes-yes. I was asking about whether, maybe, you have some questions for me first.

АП: No, no questions at all. Go ahead, so that you get everything you need, ask away, because right now we also have tension with electricity, complete tension.

КА: Yes-yes-yes, I understand. Yes, let's start from the very beginning then. What's your correct name? Your first and last name?

АП: Aleksandr. Last name – Pedchenko. With a "d".

КА: With a "d", yes. I really want to tell the story of your grandmother, your grandfather and everything that happened to them. I read what you sent me, but I need you to tell me about it. You can tell me starting a bit earlier. They were, sort of, in Bakhmut district, as far as I understand, they lived there, yes?

АП: Yes.

КА: And specifically where?

АП: Chasiv Yar.

КА: Oh, there... My God, that's horrible...

АП: Today, an hour ago, something hit there, destroyed more than three floors.

КА: What a nightmare!

АП: Right now it's unknown, about people nothing is known yet.

КА: Good thing they're not there anymore.

АП: Yes.

КА: Did you have contact with them? Because, as far as I know, with Bakhmut it was quite difficult with communication in recent months. Did you contact each other right up until the moment of shelling? How often did you call each other? I understand that you weren't there.

АП: No, we weren't there, we're in Vinnytsia Oblast. We had contact with them. Until a certain moment we contacted through Telegram, there we could chat a little bit. And recently we only contacted by phone in very rare cases.

КА: And what did they tell you? How was the situation in Chasiv Yar?

АП: In Chasiv Yar. Not in Chasovy Yar, but in Chasiv Yar. Chasiv Yar.

КА: In Chasiv Yar? Okay. Sorry.

АП: Nothing terrible. Well, the situation... There's war in the country, the situation was... Loud. You'd talk on the phone, and you could hear something fly by, explode somewhere in the distance.

КА: And they didn't want to leave, right?

АП: When we were leaving, they were categorically against it, they thought that maybe it would pass by. They wanted to stay there, and we couldn't take them against their will.

КА: I was asking: so it turns out that your whole family lived in Chasiv Yar?

АП: In Chasiv Yar, yes.

КА: And when did you evacuate with your parents?

АП: We had a house remaining, when we left, and grandmother with grandfather were looking after it.

КА: Aha. So you lived in different houses?

АП: Yes.

КА: And you left with your parents?

АП: Yes.

КА: Aha. So your family is – mom, dad, grandmother, grandfather and you. Right?

АП: Yes, yes.

КА: And when did you leave?

АП: And younger brother.

КА: And brother also left with you, right?

АП: Yes, he's little, he's six years old.

КА: And when did you leave?

АП: We left back in March 2022.

КА: Aha. So at the beginning of the full-scale war?

АП: Yes, at the beginning.

КА: And how do you think, maybe you talked with grandmother and grandfather about this, why did they so principally want to stay? What was holding them? Why didn't they want to leave?

АП: Grandfather was born himself in Chasiv Yar. Grandmother won't go anywhere without him, she won't leave him. They thought: "Well, what if it passes by? What if it doesn't touch us?" They continued living their life there. That apartment, which is destroyed, and this whole city – that's their whole life. They lived there completely. That's their youth, these places. And it was very hard for them to part with this. And when this all happened, they understood that nothing was holding them there anymore, and only then they agreed.

КА: They've been together their whole life, right?

АП: Yes. Grandmother studied at Kharkiv Engineering Institute, and then came. She's an engineer by profession, came to work in Chasiv Yar as a foreman and there at the factory met grandfather. Grandfather worked as a welder. And so they fell in love with each other and started living together. They've been living together for fifty years. January 26th will be exactly 50 years that they've been living together.

КА: Incredible! So they met, they worked together?

АП: Yes, yes.

КА: And they, it turns out, stayed there, and lived their whole life there?

АП: Yes. It turns out, first they lived in barracks. That's like such a one-story long house, and very many people lived there. They were given apartments there. Then grandmother, when she already got promoted, became head of a workshop at the factory, my mom was born, that's already the second child (mom also has a brother), the second child was born, they were allocated, given that apartment which is now destroyed. And they lived in that apartment for more than 45 years already.

КА: Oh Lord... So both your mom and her brother grew up there?

АП: Mom grew up, my uncle grew up, I grew up and my younger brother.

КА: And in general, can you tell me a bit more about grandmother and grandfather? What kind of relationship do you have?

АП: Grandmother also has a grandson, the oldest one, my cousin. But he was always far from them. And I constantly, you could say, lived at their house. I constantly came to them. I went fishing with grandfather, went to the dacha with grandmother. Well, and grandmother very much... I don't want to say that she loved someone more, but she spent more time with me and always was proud of me, wanted me to become some kind of person like that – either an artist, or "head of a collective farm," as she said, director of some agricultural firm.

КА: So you have a very close relationship?

АП: Yes, we're very close.

КА: And tell me about them in general a little bit. Your grandmother and grandfather – what kind of people are they? What did they give you? What traits from them do you have?

АП: Oh, grandfather, he's more such, a man of labor, he's hardworking, cheerful. He more likes to work with his hands. And grandmother, she's of a more such mindset, she's an engineer herself by profession, and she more like this... thinks with her head and works with her head. Grandmother taught me a lot about how to handle money, grandfather taught me specifically to work with my hands.

КА: In general you're so close with grandmother and grandfather, you spent a lot of time together. As far as I understand, with grandmother you're a bit closer than with grandfather?

АП: Yes, yes.

КА: How did you generally experience separation from them? You left in March. How hard was this for you? How did you experience this?

АП: It was very hard for me, because grandmother is for me, probably, one of the closest people to me, constantly gave me support. In any situation, it seems to me, I went more not to my parents, but to grandmother. And grandmother knew and knows very much about me. And she always supported me. Grandfather more... he just loved me. He constantly gave me candy, he stored it at home and said: "This is for grandson." I'd come, and he always... with candy... Very difficult, it was hard for me, I always worried about them. I understood that staying was impossible, but they... that was their decision. You can't just take them, put them in a car and drive them away. That's, first of all, illegal. And second, I love them, I couldn't go against their will whatever the situation might be.

КА: And how old are they, it turns out?

АП: Grandmother is from forty-eighth year, and grandfather from forty-first year. Grandmother is 74, and grandfather is 71.

КА: Eighty-one?

АП: Seventy.

КА: Oh, something, sorry, I calculated wrong, yes. And what are your grandmother and grandfather's names?

АП: Grandmother is called Lidiya, and grandfather – Vladimir.

КА: And what did you talk about when you managed to catch communication, throughout these eight-nine months? What did they tell you? Maybe you remembered something more vividly than other things?

АП: Every call of ours they told about what was happening, what situation was at home. They looked after our house, we also had a dog here, they took care of him. Told about the situation in general. And said that they missed us. Wanted us to come to them sooner. And it turned out that we came in not a very good situation, so to speak. But the main thing is that they're alive, we took them.

КА: Yes, thank God that they're alive, that's true. How did you generally find out about what happened...

АП: About what happened we found out?

КА: Yes.

АП: Look. On that day I was outside, just walking, and my mom was sitting on the riverbank and just drinking coffee there. And at that moment she was talking with grandmother. When there was the moment of explosion, mom heard through the phone how it exploded and how grandmother was screaming to grandfather, what's with him, where is he, she said that she couldn't see anything. Mom, you could say, was present at that moment there, but she was by phone, talking with her. And I already came home, dad told me what was happening at home, well, fear... And I told mom that we immediately pack up and leave. I didn't think about anything. I knew that I needed to go to the bus station, buy bus tickets, go to Kyiv, buy train tickets and go, pick up grandfather and grandmother. We managed to contact grandfather. After he got to the hospital, he called us, but he couldn't hear anything, because he had very severe shell shock. He was talking at that moment with mom, says: "Sveta, we're alive. There's no house anymore. Everything's okay with mom." But we didn't know until the end what was with grandmother. We only found out that everything was good with her, as much as it was possible, that she was alive, when we arrived in Kostiantynivka, to the hospital. That's after, it turns out, two days, after a day, it turns out. We immediately left, a day passed.

КА: What state was your family in the whole way?

АП: Look. I'm generally an emotional person, but at that moment I understood that my emotions at that moment would be unnecessary, and I traveled with the most cold head possible. Mom was very worried. I was also worried inside, but I had such... I had to see what really happened, and then evaluate the situation completely. I didn't want to wind myself up, nothing. And mom rode in the bus and sat, constantly thought, looked at photos of the destroyed house and thought that they were not telling her something, that with grandmother it was even worse than it could be.

КА: And how did you try to calm her at that moment?

АП: I calmed her. I took the phone away from her so she wouldn't look at the photos. I said: "Calm down, everything's fine. We'll arrive, see and then we'll decide everything." I felt inside that everything was fine with grandmother. After all, kindred soul, and it somehow, I don't know, energy or how. But I felt that with them, as much as possible, everything was okay, that they were at least alive.

КА: And, it turns out, grandfather called a day after the explosion?

АП: No, he called in the evening after this happened. They were first taken, when this happened, to Bakhmut, they patched them up there, well, stitched them up. They went to Kostiantynivka. In Kostiantynivka they gave them great help, gave grandmother different help, put her in the hospital. And grandfather was released home. And grandfather went himself to Chasiv Yar, to the basement to sleep. He didn't want to stay in the hospital. Then we arrived. On the road grandfather called mom once more. Mom says: "Any way possible, I don't know how you want, – she says, – but you're going with us." Mom told him to pack things. And our acquaintance took him to Kostiantynivka. And in Kostiantynivka already mom's acquaintance provided us housing, we stayed there five days. Picked up grandmother from the hospital, got on the train and came to Kyiv.

КА: And when you met with grandfather, it turns out, you saw him first, earlier than grandmother, as far as I understand?

АП: No, grandfather was at that moment in Chasiv Yar, when we were traveling. The first one I saw, in what state, was grandmother. I went into her ward, and I saw her. And then only my acquaintance drove up and brought grandfather.

КА: And what did you see? You go into the ward in Kostiantynivka. What state was grandmother in general?

АП: Grandmother was in a state... she... she was frightened. That was already the next day. She was frightened. She was... she had stitches on her face. She had a very swollen face and bruises all over her body, which are still healing even now. And she could barely see with both eyes, because dust and glass fragments got in them.

КА: What were you generally experiencing at that moment? What do you remember from your feelings at that moment?

АП: As I told you, I traveled the whole way in such... not in calmness, but with a cold head. I went in, I saw that grandmother was alive. I exhaled. Came up, hugged her. Said: "That's it! – I say. – I don't know anything, we're packing up and going after the doctors say what they say, discharge us, we'll go." I exhaled with relief, maybe. I just saw the situation, from which I could already push off and take further actions.

КА: And mom? How was she at that moment?

АП: Mom? Mom cried. Saw grandmother, that she was alive, that with her, as much as possible, everything was fine. And she also calmed down, saw that she was alive. Because she wound herself up very much on the road.

КА: And what did grandmother and grandfather tell about what happened to them, what happened at the moment when the Russian rocket hit the house?

АП: Grandfather came from the street, he was walking the dog just then, and grandmother came from the store. Grandfather went to the kitchen to drink tea. And grandmother went to the living room, mom was calling her, she took the phone, sat in the armchair to talk on the phone with mom. The moment of explosion happened. Grandmother doesn't remember the moment of explosion at all, but grandfather says that grandmother was screaming, calling grandfather. Grandfather was thrown back. He was sitting on a chair near the window, he was thrown into the hallway. He got up, went, found grandmother. Grandmother couldn't see anything. He sat her on the bed. Then their acquaintance nurse came, started giving them help. And after some time the ambulance came, and they were taken by ambulance. Grandmother, she... at that moment it was such a state of shock that she didn't feel any pain. She touched her face and understood that it was covered in blood. Her first words that she asked the doctors: "Is there skin on my face?" – because she was worried that everything had burned on her. She didn't feel any pain, she thought that it had burned. And that was blood together with dust, sticky.

КА: So grandfather was affected less, it turns out?

АП: Yes, grandfather... Grandfather was in the farthest room from the explosion, and grandmother was just in the second room from the explosion. That's five meters from the hit itself. And grandfather was at ten meters.

КА: And they were delivered to Bakhmut hospital?

АП: Yes, gave first aid, stitched up wounds, washed grandmother's eyes a little bit. And then already, in Kostiantynivka, she saw only the next day, well, started to see little by little.

КА: And, it turns out, with her it was because of the blast wave or because of dust that her vision was like that?

АП: Because of everything, because she has both closed traumatic brain injury, she has because of dust, because of the strong impact. She says her eyes turned yellow, she couldn't see anything, everything was yellow for her.

КА: What a nightmare! And in Bakhmut hospital they didn't keep them, because there...

АП: Because it's impossible to stay there. They gave first aid, operated and took them to Kostiantynivka, to a safer place.

КА: So in Bakhmut hospital it was unsafe, there was just a situation?

АП: Yes, it's unsafe there, because there it's already five kilometers, you could say, even less, to the frontline.

КА: Regular shelling happens there, right?

АП: Yes.

КА: And in general, is it known to you about Chasiv Yar? How much is everything destroyed there?

АП: Well look. The information that I know – is that when we were still in Kostiantynivka, and a day before we were to leave, there was another hit in grandmother's yard, just into the yard next to the entrance, not far from grandmother's. But there were no casualties, just people had their windows knocked out. The hit came on asphalt. And it also flew into one house, there's a hole in the house. And today, what I told you earlier, there was also a hit there, and in one entrance two floors from the top were destroyed.

КА: What horror. So, you came to Kostiantynivka to pick up grandmother and grandfather. And grandmother was in shock, right? She still didn't fully... her vision was still...

АП: Didn't realize what happened to her, yes.

КА: But she recognized you?

АП: She recognized me. She, when she saw me... she already saw little by little, she saw: "Grandson!" She got scared, but she was also happy that I came. She had emotions, they recognized me.

КА: And did she recognize mom?

АП: Mom? Of course, she recognized her. She raised her for forty years.

КА: Well you know, closed traumatic brain injury, anything can happen.

АП: Yes, anything could happen. Mom still worries so there will be fewer consequences. We'll go to Vinnytsia soon and do an MRI for her.

КА: That's important. And grandfather? Your friend brought grandfather from Chasiv Yar, what state was he in general? What did he tell? Can you tell a little about this?

АП: Grandfather... Yes, I can. Grandfather was in a state of shell shock. He didn't fully, maybe... He understood what he was doing, but not fully. He had some actions that were unnatural for him.

КА: For example?

АП: He had, it turns out, his eyebrow severely cut and his head. They stitched up his head and eyebrow. And he also had one part of his face swollen. Grandmother had her whole face cut by fragments and swollen, and grandfather only half – just from the side of the wall where the blast wave went. And grandfather also had his shoulder injured. They just bandaged it for him, there was a small wound. But when we came here, we went to a doctor, and yesterday they stitched it up for him, because there it started opening up a little bit.

КА: And you said that grandfather developed some unnatural habits. What was that like? How did this manifest?

АП: Now, I'll... How can I explain this to you? He was, it turns out, in shock. He was gathering things that they had taken to the shed, to preserve in case of something, to preserve some things. He took everything in a row, he didn't understand that... He knew that these things existed, but he brought a lot of unnecessary stuff. He said that he knew half the people that he generally... well, as far as I can know, he couldn't, he had never even seen them in his life, because he was in one city, and people were already in such cities that... He already had such, I don't know, memory lapses. Generally he said that déjà vu, the brain started drawing other pictures.

КА: And since he was separated for this small time from grandmother... How did they experience separation, without each other?

АП: They literally spent a night without each other. Grandfather was very worried that... He wasn't very worried about himself. At the moment of impact, when the nurse came to give help, she first approached grandfather, grandfather says: "You don't need to touch me, give help to grandmother first, and my turn will come later." He was very worried about grandmother. And grandmother worried about grandfather. But grandmother also worried because we wouldn't find out about what happened to them, because her phone broke. Grandfather came, saw grandmother after a night of separation. He hugged her, sat next to her. He's in a lighter condition, we just took him to that house that mom's acquaintance provided us. And he was always with us, under our supervision. And grandmother was five days in the hospital.

КА: But you came to her, it turns out, all the time?

АП: Yes, we came every day together with grandfather to her.

КА: And during these five days what state was grandfather in general?

АП: He started walking, the places where the impact hit him started hurting little by little, his shoulder. He was in such a state that he could walk, but he needed a little help. He was, well, in a more or less normal state. For that situation that happened to him, in quite good condition.

КА: And emotionally?

АП: Emotionally? Emotionally he understood that all the life that was before, it was completely destroyed. There was simply nowhere to return to anymore. And he just had to accept this. Same as grandmother. It was a little easier for grandmother to part with all this, but she also very much worried because of this. But grandfather, he very much emotionally... He even, so to say, shed a stingy man's tear, when he understood that that's it, we're leaving. Waved his hand after Chasiv Yar, got in a taxi and went to Kramatorsk with us.

КА: And why do you say that it was easier for grandmother? Because grandfather was born there?

АП: Yes, grandfather was born there, and grandmother herself was born in Stanove in Sumy Oblast. Until 18 years old she spent in Stanove, because then she went to study. And for her home was there. Yes, that was also their life, home, but grandmother, she more understood that she was going to her daughter, and they would take care of her. She understood that staying there was also unsafe already. Understanding started reaching her that it was unsafe to be there. And grandfather wanted to stay there, because there was his whole life. He raised pigeons, went fishing, lived his life and enjoyed it. And here he had to completely remake his life completely, in an instant simply. It's very hard – to lose a home.

КА: And he retired and started raising pigeons?

АП: He raised pigeons his whole life – both when he worked, and since childhood. His father had pigeons. All the things he did in retirement, he did before too, it's just that work left his life and there was pension. He raised grandchildren – me, the younger one. Went fishing, for mushrooms, raised pigeons, went to the dacha, looked after the household.

КА: You as a grandson who knows these people well, grandmother is one of your closest people. Still, I want to try a little bit to understand why it was harder for grandfather to accept that they were leaving from there.

АП: Most likely, because grandfather in his life, didn't leave home very often. He went to the sea with us twice – and that because we dragged him. It was more usual for him to be in one place, he's not a lover of going somewhere. Yes, there before he met grandmother, he traveled a little bit around the world, he served in Germany, in seventy-second year, I think, and he traveled a little bit. But still he's more such a person who stays in one place. And he understands that he has... Here he woke up, he went to the shed, there he opened the chickens, opened the pigeons and went to do his business further. He had an established life. He's more such a person. And grandmother is more such already... she can go somewhere, more not technologically, but... How can I tell you this?

КА: More easy-going?

АП: Yes, easy-going and more like youthful. And grandfather, he has his life, he does his business, and he doesn't need anyone or anything else.

КА: And in general what kind of relationship do grandmother and grandfather have between themselves? What are they like as a couple that lived together for 50 years?

АП: Oh, they love each other very much, constantly support each other. They practically all 50 years never separated for long. They're always in the same apartment, go to the dacha together, come to our house together, visiting. Always they're together. And I want to tell you that I was always amazed how you can live your whole life with one person. I really wanted this very much, but I was amazed, couldn't understand how for 50 years not to get tired of each other, although they were 24/7, you could say, always together. Yes, they have this grumbling at each other, but when you look at this, you more... well, you smile and understand that this is real love.

КА: It seems to me, it's so important – to have such an example before your eyes.

АП: Yes. It's a very big example for me. Also my parents. I'm not such a person to meet with everyone, so to say. For me it's important to have one person I can rely on. And I know that they won't betray me and will always be near, at any minute. Even this situation showed that grandfather and grandmother are very united with each other. And even despite such a situation that grandmother now has with her face, appearance... Now some flaws, grandfather comforts her and says: "You're my beauty! Everything will be fine." Says: "Now the skin will peel off – you'll be beautiful." Grandfather is already a little easier, yes. This is a big example of real love, how it should be.

КА: What happiness that they have each other and that everyone's alive. And what about the house, their apartment in which you grew up, your mom?

АП: From their apartment only bare walls remained. All property, accumulated over 50 years of life together, was simply destroyed. And repairs, everything was done by their son-in-law, that is my dad. And that was his labor, grandmother's labor, grandfather's labor was simply destroyed in one instant. I thank everything in the world for them staying alive. In that apartment they miraculously stayed alive, because there everything is cut by fragments. If grandmother had been literally a meter away, in another place, she could have... Same with grandfather.

КА: And what state are grandmother and grandfather in now? You've already moved them, I understand correctly, to Kyiv?

АП: No, we're now in Vinnytsia Oblast.

КА: So you're just planning to move them, yes?

АП: No, we moved them to Vinnytsia Oblast, since here we have housing where we can look after them.

КА: Did it seem to me or did you take them to Kyiv, to the hospital?

АП: We traveled through Kyiv. We traveled from Kramatorsk to Kyiv, and from Kyiv we already came here. It didn't seem to you, yes, I said that, yes. I just didn't finish telling.

КА: Aha, aha. So you'll be treated in Vinnytsia Oblast, yes?

АП: Yes. We'll go for MRI to Vinnytsia.

КА: And how are they both now?

АП: Grandfather suffered less, he's already in better condition, but still he has pain, shoulder, because they stitched him up, as I said, recently, headache. [Condition] is stable average. They're getting better, you could say.

КА: And grandmother?

АП: Grandmother has very severe bruises all over her body, bruises and black-and-blue marks of very large sizes. Her face... they removed her stitches, but it's also already going better. At the moment of explosion her dentures fell out of her mouth, and now it's hard for her to chew, she now grinds everything, eats.

КА: Will she lie in the hospital? Or does she not need this now?

АП: No, now she doesn't need such inpatient treatment. They prescribed her medications, and we can help her at home and take care of her ourselves.

КА: And what emotional state are they both in now?

АП: In emotional state? They're now in a state of accepting that they're starting a new stage of life and that they need to move forward.

КА: And how does this happen with them? How do they experience this?

АП: They sit, talk, discuss this topic – what happened like this, what they might do in the future. Well, the main thing is for the war to end. And then it will already be possible to build some plans, and do something. Now the main thing for them is to restore their health, continue living and enjoy life.

КА: And they talk between themselves and still build some minimal plans? Maybe they told you what plans they have for the future? What do they generally think about the future?

АП: Plans for the future? They're already 74 years old. You can quote their words. And their plans for the future are possibly to educate me. They very much worry about their family. They're such people that they know how to give help and are always glad to help someone, but they have a hard time accepting help, it's very hard for them to accept help. And when people help them either financially, or somehow... they're very grateful for all this, but it's very hard for them to accept this. They have such upbringing, you have to understand after all. Plans for the future are to raise grandchildren, see great-grandchildren. They want to live their years that are allotted to them with dignity. And everything should be good for them. Plans for life are to continue being happy, support each other further and help their family.

КА: When Ukraine wins, when all this ends, do they and you too, your family generally think about returning? Or will you stay there?

АП: Everyone wants very much to return. Everyone very much worries about that one house that was ours, so it would be whole and unharmed. But for the state that Chasiv Yar is in now, it's very hard to try to build some plans. But everyone very much wants to return there, because there was some kind of very good atmosphere there. There too, you could say, my childhood passed. They want to return, that's their life. But how it will be further – nobody knows.

КА: Well and you too, yes, want to?

АП: Well, return my parents, because I have somewhat different plans for life. I already want to develop further, and not be in that small town.

КА: And in general when you saw photos of the destroyed house, where your grandmother and grandfather miraculously survived, where all your childhood passed, where you grew up, what were you experiencing at that moment?

АП: Mom was very worried, she cried, she had a very difficult emotional state. When I saw this, my whole life, so to say, ran before my eyes, all the memories that were there. I spent, you could say, 70 percent of my life in that apartment. For me there weren't places there that I didn't know, where I hadn't climbed. And it was very hard to look at all this. For me the most important thing was at that moment, when I saw all this, to know that everything was fine with grandmother and grandfather, because after all the apartment and all the property that was there – that's not so important, and the important thing is our close ones and that they would be near and everything would be fine with them. And finances and everything else – that can be earned and bought. It's not so... How can I tell you?

КА: Valuable?

АП: Valuable, yes. The most valuable thing that exists in our life is our close ones and our life.

КА: How are you in general now, when you've already moved grandmother and grandfather? I heard that you pulled yourself together emotionally very strongly before going for them. And you yourself said that you're an emotional person. Has this situation released you? How are you now?

АП: Upon arriving here everything completely released me, I shed a stingy man's tear. When I was traveling there, I had a lot of stress. Very many people wrote to me who wanted to help grandfather and grandmother. I tried to answer everyone, write back. Then, I didn't know until the end what was with grandmother. I was supporting mom at that moment. And mom was also performing very many functions. She was also looking for how to get them out, what to do, how to live there those couple of days while grandmother would be in the hospital. On that day very much of everything fell on us, and this needed to be endured. And when you endure this, it doesn't just go away somewhere, evaporate, but it stays in you. And until you let this go, it was very hard to live with this.

КА: And what helped let this go?

АП: Well, I know. I just arrived, understood that that's it, everyone's safe. I exhaled, went, got myself coffee, sat, calmed down and started already thinking about a plan of further actions that would need to be done with them, thinking about the hospital and everything else.

КА: What was the route in general? It turns out, Kostiantynivka – Kramatorsk; Kramatorsk – Kyiv; Kyiv – Vinnytsia Oblast?

АП: Yes. It turns out, there was Kostiantynivka – Kramatorsk. In Kramatorsk we got on a train. On the train we came to Kyiv. In Kyiv we stayed literally two hours, waited for the train to Vinnytsia. We stayed in Vinnytsia three hours. That was at night, and volunteers helped us with housing for three hours, so we could spend the night, roughly speaking. And these same volunteers brought us to Vinnytsia Oblast, to the place where we are now.

КА: And how did grandmother and grandfather endure this whole quite difficult journey after all?

АП: We tried to make more comfortable conditions for them, as much as it was possible. And they endured it relatively easily, as much as it was possible. It turns out, to Kyiv we traveled quite comfortably, but sitting. And from Kyiv we took such a train so they could lie down a little bit, sleep a little bit. Then already in Vinnytsia they helped us, they also slept a little bit. And we got in a car and traveled literally about an hour and a half by car, and that's it, they were already in place, in safety.

КА: The whole way what did you talk about or not talk? These were such first-first days after experiencing rescue, you could say, by miracle. What did you all talk about all this time among yourselves? Or on the contrary – you sat and were silent, because there were no words to speak?

АП: On the road we more talked about such topics... Well what on the road there? Something to eat, maybe drink, whether they were comfortable. We didn't talk about the topic that happened to us. Grandmother just worried about how people would look at her, because her appearance at that moment got a little worse due to the wounds that were on her face. And so we, as far as I remember, we practically didn't talk, we only resolved such road situations. And they slept practically the whole way, because they were tired after such a thing.

КА: They would be tired after such a thing. I have one last question left. And then I'll have a couple of technical questions. Is there anything about the full-scale war, about grandmother and grandfather, about yourself, about the situation your family had to face, that you would like to tell, and I didn't ask you about this?

АП: Probably no, there won't be anything like that. Everything I wanted, I told you. I sincerely decided to talk with you and told everything that I currently feel, experience. КА: I am very, very grateful to you for this, for how honest our conversation turned out to be and how truly sincerely you answered all the questions. And this is worth a lot, and I am very grateful to you. And I really hope that everything will be good in your family. Thank God, grandmother and grandfather are with you. And everything else... If only the war would end.

АП: Yes. The main thing is for the war to end with our victory, our victory.

КА: Yes, absolutely, of course. I have a couple of technical questions. Tell me, how would it be best to introduce you? Maybe you want to indicate your profession or what specialty you are studying for, how old you are. We want to present you as a hero in the reference. What would you like to say about yourself?

АП: I'll give you information about myself now, and you can decide there what you'll need. I finished nine grades in school, then went to study at Bakhmut Agricultural Lyceum in the profession "tractor operator." I worked one year in the profession, until the beginning of the full-scale war. And in the future I want to still fulfill grandmother's dream - to become either an artist or an actor, to make grandmother happy. She saw these abilities in me and constantly told me about this, that: "You need this. Go, study. And I see what will come of you." And so by profession I'm a tractor operator. I'm twenty years old.

КА: This is an important story about how grandmother saw artistic abilities in you, and now you want to become one. Very, very-very much hope that everything will work out, and you will be happy, and grandmother too.

АП: Thank you, thank you for the pleasant conversation.

КА: That's all, thank you very much. Yes, thank you. And health to your whole family.

АП: That's all.

КА: All the best. Goodbye.

АП: Goodbye.

КА: Goodbye.